The Yamaha Road Star Warrior Forum

Hey All...

Ok...My Warrior is acting freaky for some reason, I can't understand why either. She was running fine Saturday, no issues at all...I didn't ride she Sunday, but this morning when I fired her up to go to work. She stalled first off, but fired up and I kicked her into gear and rode off. She hesitated a bit, but I thought she just wasn't warmed up enough. Anyway I got to the intersection and sitting at the stop light she was idling OK and when the light changed I rode off. She hesitated again...As I got to the main roadway I opened up the throttle, she started hesitating, backfiring and running rough. I had to keep twisting the throttle to keep her running and she still kept backfiring, and hesitating. I turned around to go back home because I figured that there is definitely something wrong. She kept running rough, hesitating and stalled out, just before I got home, but I got her fired up again and made it home.

Anyway I pulled her into my garage and had to take my truck to work...

Well...I got home this afternoon and tried to start her up...She started but was running really rough. The idle was like really low and I could smell like raw fuel. I figured that for some reason the engine was dumping more fuel than it needed. I pulled the plugs and three of the four looked good, one was wet. So I cleaned all the plugs and checked the gaps, just to be on the safe side. While I had the tank off I checked all the wires and hoses and didn't see anything out of place or that looked like it was disconnected. I started her up again and she was running rough and the idle was low. I still smelled that raw fuel odor too...

So I hooked up my laptop to a PCIII to check to see if I had some kind of problem. When I started the bike I got the map and watched the idle. The TPS was steady at 0%...The idle started off at like 800 to 850 RPMs and than dropped to like 600, than to like 550 to 500 RPMs. Then all of a sudden it jumped to like 1100 RPMs and than up to 16000 RPMs and even, as high as 22000 RPMs. But all this time the idle was jumping around the bike never revved up. It just kept idling real low and running rough to the point to where it would cut off, if I tried to give it any throttle.

It starts, but it just runs rough and idles like really low and I can smell raw fuel when it is running. I think the PCIII is telling the engine it needs more fuel when it jumps the RPMs up and it can't burn off the fuel because, the RPMs aren't really what the PCIII is telling the engine. If you know what I mean...

I have checked everything that I know of...I disconnected the battery hoping it would reset everything, but it didn't help. I even unplugged the ECU and that didn't help either. For now I am losted...The bike was running fine like I said on Saturday and I didn't ride her Sunday. I did wash and clean her up, but I didn't do anything different, as fas as washing her. I mean it's not like the first time I washed her. And I never had issues with her after I washed her before...I did check the wiring under the seat to see if they were wet. I didn't see any moisture under the seat and on the wires...

I did do the "Perfect Install" for my PCIII about two weeks ago, but again she was running good, up to this morning anyway. I have the Samson2map installed on my PCIII and been running that map for awhile now. I even tried to switch out maps and it still run rough and did the same RPM jump.

My bike is an 05' Midnight Warrior with Samson Short Slashers, AIS blocked and Baron's BAK.

Any ideas, help, suggestions, opinions...I could use some assistance here.

Thanks!

Mark aka Mad Man

I hate to say it...but it could be the infamous CPS failure.

If you used a pressure washer...it could be that. Regular hose...shoudn't be a problem...

If you have verified the TPS...the the usual suspects are CPS and LCV for wierd A/F problems like this....

parabellum,

Thanks! I used a regular hose, not a pressure washer.

So you think it is the CPS?

How do I verify the TPS?

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

Mark aka Mad Man

Are there any error codes on the tach? Sounds like a TPS problem to me.

CPS is a good possibility. That jumping tach is something I've seen before on an old car I had. The main coil wire was corroded causing misfires and the tach to spike. I'd pull the coil/plug wires and look them over first...

Madman, I'd take a look at the throttle body joints & make sure they didn't loos'n up. Also check the coils & leads, but I have to agree everyone else, it seems to be pointing to the CPS or TPS in regards to the backfiring & pop'n. Low idle could be caused by the LCV, mine was bad, really low idle 500-600 rpm. Here's a string on codes & "how to" diagnostic checks:http://www.rswarrior.com/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=43676&SearchTerms=diagnostic,checks

Blacksinister.

srahz,

Nope...I'm not getting any error codes. I did disconnect and reconnected the battery so I don't know if it reset everything, or not. I have started it and cut it off a few times now and since get no error codes. I didn't even get an error code from my PCIII...

Strange how all of a sudden it started acting up...I did start it up Sunday after I washed it, but it was just to ride her back into the garage. I don't remember her acting up on Sunday when I did that...

This morning I pushed her out of garage...Started her up...When back in the garage to close the door and come back out, jumped on the bike and that's when it all started.

Huh! Strange...

Thanks!

Mark aka Mad Man

Mine has acted up after a washing before, with a "regualr hose" as well. It doesn't like getting wet under the seat apparently. Mine has done this twice...once after a washing, once after sitting at work late one night and get rained on.

There is a very simple diagnostic test thru the Tach to check the min~max feedback angle of the TPS from the ECU. You should remove the right side air intake cover and physically check the resistance of the TPS with a VOM. Also check the connector connections at the sensor as well as under the seat.

I made up a couple of female pigtail crimp connectors with stranded wire to attach to TPS and VOM with alligator clips. That test was done with the sensor plug disconnected.

Also, check out the writers thread of a mis-diagnosed TPS that turned out to be a failed CPS [:0] http://rswarrior.com/forums/p/23814/283706.aspx#283706

quote:

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Originally posted by MadMan

parabellum,

Thanks! I used a regular hose, not a pressure washer.

So you think it is the CPS?

How do I verify the TPS?

Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

Mark aka Mad Man

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Wow...Alan saves the day

Like Alan said, you can measure the TPS output to see if it looks right. See if it jumps around at certain ranges...or if it changes non linearly as you twist the throttle.

The CPS is really just a replacement item. Parts for that job will run you $70 between the CPS and the gasket. If your problem isnt' the TPS..you can replace the CPS and upgrade the new one with silicone. That way even if it isn't the CPS, you will have piece of mind about the new one.

Best

Chris

Ship To:
AlanH
Corona CA
US

1 of 5PX-85885-00-00 - .THROTTLE SENSOR ASSY @ $107.16ea.

Subtotal: $107.16
Shipping: $10.19 via UPS Ground
Sales Tax: $0.00
Total Amt: $117.35

South Seattle Sports Plaza
33003 Pacific Highway South
Federal Way, WA 98003
253-838-3290

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Crankshaft Position Sensor (CPS) & Engine Cover Gasket
Purchased from Corona Yamaha @ List Price + tax
$72.50

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Photos of TPS during testing & replacement as well as crimp terminals & tools used during R&R and calibration

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WOW![:0]

THANKS BIG TIME AlanH!! You're the man!

I'll test the TPS as you described first and see if that's the problem. But, reading through all the topics and posts about the CPS failures. I'm thinking it's the CPS, but it never hurts to check other things. Besides I may go ahead to do the "Preventative Maintenance" on the CPS, as well. Like parabellum said, "Just for peace of mind..."

Parts won't cost me that much...Since my race team is sponsored by the local motorcycle dealership. I get parts for cost +25% which saves me a lot...So a little peace of mind is worth a little cost.

Thanks again AlanH and to everyone else who helped...I really do appreciate it.

I'll keep you all posted on what the problem final was once I find it and fixed it.

Later!

Mark aka Mad Man

OK!

This is actually funny... []

And I sure feel pretty stupid... [V]

But, Oh...Well...I guess it even happens to the best of us!

Anyway...After testing and checking everything that I could possibly think of that would cause of my bike to run so poorly and trying to figure out what was wrong with it. I finally just said the HECK WITH IT and took her up to the Service Dept. at the local dealership to see if they could find the problem, or problems.

Well...She was up there for three days (And I was expecting the worst...) [] Well...I got a call about 30 minutes ago from the Service Dept. and they told me my bike was ready to be picked up. I was shocked and surprised, but then I thought may be they gave up on it too and just wanted me to come get it. So I ask the guy, if he meant I could come pick it up because it was fixed, or because they couldn't figure out what was wrong with the bike. The guy said the bike was fixed and ready to be picked up...Immediately my heart started pounding again and it was like a BIG weight had been lifted off my chest. So I ask what did they find wrong with it and he replied the problem was (Now get this...) A LOOSE COIL WIRE!! [:0]

CAN YOU FREAKIN' BELIEVE IT?!

All it was was a LOOSE COIL WIRE! I can't believe I didn't find that or even notice it. And wouldn't you know I tested and checked everything but the coils...

Huh! And I would have bet it was the CPS...I even told the mechanic that it's probably the CPS, so be sure to check it. Although the mechanic said he hadn't heard of any issues with the CPS on Warriors and was actually willing to bet it was the PCIII. He told me they have had a few bikes come up there with PCIII installed and the bike was running bad. Once the PCIII was disconnected the bike ran fine...

Oh...Well...It's funny how the littlest thing can cause so much trouble and grief. I'm glad it was just a loose coil wire and nothing more... []

I'd like to thank all the members who replied to my request for help...I really do appreciate it!!

So if you ever have a problem...Just remember to check the little things and look at everything, even the things that you least expect. Because you just never know... []

The Mad Man is back on the road again!! [^]

Mark aka Mad Man