The Yamaha Road Star Warrior Forum

i'll check it again later today. im headin out on a ride with my friend

You know I didn't remove the charcoal cannister, and there are times that I find myself near that little rectangular black box, & smell heavy doses of raw gas. I guess I missed that part of the BAK - AIS install that removed that guy. Can you give me a quick uninstall for that thing? I can go and find my paperwork for the whole job, but if it's really simple & you can give me directions I'd take them. I have 79K miles on it & the bike is feeling a little rough when riding sanely, ie. easy starts, easy accelerations up to speed, not slamming gears. I don't want to find myself damaging anything at this stage in my life, so I take it easier than when I first got it. It's all still stock except for the mods, and I love the dependibility. I want it to keep up, keeping up. On the ECU tweaks, does it make sense to you, for me to go into my ECU & tweak it so I "load" the C01 & C02 adjustments with more fuel? In your opinion, which I trust, would this give more head room for the PC3 to have a little more finite metering control? BTW fuel consumption is normal, 33mpg in the worst I can recall, while an occasional 55 - 60mpg on some long down hill excursions, like returning to the Bay Area from Reno where there is a long down hill section where we all get great mileage. Typical day to day mileage is 37 - 42 commuting, 30+ miles RT...

by all means do the 27/29 ecu wire mod...so simple and follow the info to get to the stock mixture settings.....good to lnow before mucking about with the settings....as AzW notes...please post the results...when you have them...be interesting to know what the latest set of stock settings are ...we are trying to collect as many as poss for the records...cheers tom...a guru should be along to say more about the ecu in relation to the PC3 settings...all my info is hearsay...lol

Tomba, Thx for pitching in here. Long ago, prior to installing my PC3, I did the ECU mod w/switch. I tweaked it a few times before I got my PC3, but my "original" settings were in the neighborhood of 19, 21, I don't remamber exactly, nor do I remember to which cyl the numbers go to. My question stems around how the pc3 works it's magic. That's why I asked if it would be of any help if I went into my ECU & added some fuel so the PC3 had more to work with. I would still like to know if there is any validity to performing that tweak. I had tweaked the ECU when I installed the BAK & again when I installed my V&H ProPipe. Once I got the PC3, I loaded a MAP I acquired off this 4m. I have since been to the Dyno, & have had one, off the dyno, tweak by the tech that did my original MAP.You're up to date... - Jim

I bought mine in Arizona, so I didn't need to toss the charcoal box. 

As I recall, you unbolt and remove the cannister, and you are left with a hose from the fuel tank (that you keep), and a hose from the cannister to the venturi base.  You should have cap-nippled the venturi vacuum port when you did the -AIS.  If yes, then the cannister hose is unattached and should no longer be sucking vacuum, and that might be the reason for the gas smell.

I'm admittedly very weak with the charcoal cannister removal, so you should check your paperwork from back then, but from memory (argh!) this is correct.

jimsnorton:

You know I didn't remove the charcoal cannister, and there are times that I find myself near that little rectangular black box, & smell heavy doses of raw gas. I guess I missed that part of the BAK - AIS install that removed that guy. Can you give me a quick uninstall for that thing? I can go and find my paperwork for the whole job, but if it's really simple & you can give me directions I'd take them. 

You should minimize ECU bumps and keep them small and well-documented so you can back out of them.   You don't want to make the bump rich just so you can lean it out with the PC3.  Let them work in concert with each other.  When you bump, you need to verify conditions by pulling a spark plug from each jug and 'reading' it to determine if its too rich, or too lean.  When the plugs 'read' correctly (see the Popular Mods post for links to a few good plug-reading-charts) then you should leave your ECU bump where it is and document its a good setting.

Sometimes a dynotuner will want to set the CO1 and CO2 to zero just because.  There's no mechanical reason, some just do it because.  Once your bike is dynotuned you won't want to play with the ecu bump anymore, it'll just mess up a good tune.

jimsnorton:

 On the ECU tweaks, does it make sense to you, for me to go into my ECU & tweak it so I "load" the C01 & C02 adjustments with more fuel? In your opinion, which I trust, would this give more head room for the PC3 to have a little more finite metering control?

Yep your mileage is about like the rest of us!

jimsnorton:

  BTW fuel consumption is normal, 33mpg in the worst I can recall, while an occasional 55 - 60mpg on some long down hill excursions, like returning to the Bay Area from Reno where there is a long down hill section where we all get great mileage. Typical day to day mileage is 37 - 42 commuting, 30+ miles RT.

The PC3 adds-to or subtracts-from the amount of fuel the Yamaha ECU Fuel Map says to inject.  More accurately, the Yamaha ECU Fuel Map tells the injectors to energize (spray fuel) for an amount of time.  The PC3 modifies this time.  A negative number lessens injector on-time (leaner).  A positive number increases injector on-time (richer).

The method by which the ECU parameters CO1 and CO2 interact with the Yamaha ECU Fuel map are unpublished, and I won't get into that because there's plenty of ink on the subject.  Specifically, look near the bottom of the first section in the Popular Mods post for a paragraph about ECU Bumps.  That is the best paragraph I can write to fairly describe the middle-ground between the two camps of thought.  Both side have valid points and its too much to get into, so I won't here. 

If helpful, see the link to the Popular Mods post in my signature area below.

[see also below]

jimsnorton:

My question stems around how the pc3 works it's magic.  [see above]

I have since been to the Dyno, & have had one, off the dyno, tweak by the tech that did my original MAP. [ECU bumps after a dynotune are counter-productive, just 'read' your spark plugs and you'll know if the tuner did good work]

Hi there Doc!  Yes, great advise to post CO1 and CO2 numbers, I'm still keeping mine in my Gallery, just bumped a little leaner today since I still haven't been up the (rainy and snowy) mountain to the tuner yet hehe.  Its running pretty good with the changes this year, but the old dynotune isn't valid anymore .  Once its re-dynotuned, I won't fiddle with the bump anymore.  It would be a waste of good tuning money, and cut into my beer budget!   Its sorta too bad he doesn't have the original numbers, but its always good to record what-ever is there, we've all gotta start someplace.  Who knows when it'll be handy.

tomba:

by all means do the 27/29 ecu wire mod...so simple and follow the info to get to the stock mixture settings.....good to lnow before mucking about with the settings....as AzW notes...please post the results...when you have them...be interesting to know what the latest set of stock settings are ...we are trying to collect as many as poss for the records...cheers tom...a guru should be along to say more about the ecu in relation to the PC3 settings...all my info is hearsay...lol

Yo - it seems to me now that stock ECU settings should be somewhere between zero and minus 7... max... with the one or max 2 units difference between front and back jugs...figures over zero plus 5 to 10 seem to work for guys with modded exhausts and filters etc...but way over +10...hmmm..seems to rich and no cooling from the mixture either...only plug checking would confirm that of course....very time consuming...but would be good to have details posted....i'm sorry to see original stock settings going awol..but if the beasts back to stock at any time, then i'm with anywhere around -1 to -7 with front jug 1 or 2 increments towards plus from the rear reading - cheers prof

jimsnorton .... neither the BAK or AIS install & modifications have any relevance or effect to the California only canister so you didn't miss anything in the instructions

Here's a thread that discusses the subject in detail: Canister Removal Done Correctly

If you’re interested in cleaning up the hoses read further down the page to here: http://rswarrior.com/forums/p/123630/988274.aspx#988274